Items of note:
IX. New Business
C. Discussion of Open Enrollment Report (30 Min)
We again received a large number of open enrollment requests, a total of 212 in and 41 out. The majority of applications (77) are for the high school, another 47 are for Glacial Drumlin. The next largest group is T4K which has 21 applications. Each OE student brings with them 2/3 of the usual funding, so under the right circumstances they can improve the budget picture. We can't turn down OE applications unless we don't have space
X. Unfinished Business
B. Discussion and Possible Approval of Location of 6th Grade Programming (30 Min)
Information about the possible move is found by clicking here.
The administration has made an educational and management case for combining the the 6th grade student into Glacial Drumlin. Against that I balance the "contract" of the last referendum that placed the 6th graders in their home communities. The communication I have had on this one has been mixed.
C. Discussion of Budget Reduction Proposals (30 Min)
D. Discussion of Possible Consolidation of Maywood & Winnequah Schools (30 Min)
E. Discussion and Possible Approval of Revisions to Board Rule 343.2
Guidelines for Class Size (20 Min)
Class sizes are big drivers of cost in the district, they impact our open enrollment options and teacher overload pay, but clearly the individual attention a student gets decreases as class size.
F. Discussion of District Split Study 2005 (10 Min)This issue has been raised by members of the community and board members. I dug up the editorial I wrote that was featured in the Cap Times after attending the 2005 split study report:
Recently the results of a study examining the impact that splitting the Monona Grove School District would have on programming was presented to the MGHS School Board and the citizens of Monona and Cottage Grove. The study identified four small school districts, similar in size and funding to the Monona only district that would result from a MGSD split, and compared those programs to the current Monona Grove High School. According to the study, when compared to MGHS, these small schools:
1. Offer half the number of core courses (average 37 vs. 70).
2. Offer half the number of elective courses (average 38 vs. 74)
3. Struggle to offer AP courses because of a lack of willing or qualified teachers.
4. Rely on “creative solutions”, such as distance learning and online courses, as a substitute for classroom instruction.
5. Offer fewer athletic options outside the “major” sports
6. Have only one or two teachers per subject area.
7. Have difficulty retaining qualified administrators as they use small districts as stepping-stones to larger districts.
8. Share staff between middle and high schools.
9. Often have all K-12 students in a single facility.
10. Have special education students attend regular courses because there are not resources to offer separate classes.
11. Have fewer co-curricular offerings (example: none of the comparable schools offered an Orchestra)
12. And in at least one case were unable to offer the foreign language of choice because of the inability to find a qualified teacher.
Despite the stated theme of the presentation (”Not Good, Not Bad. - Just Different”) the issues identified in the study are, indeed, objectively bad. The issues raised by the study are certainly not consistent with the kind of educational opportunities this community expects for its children, nor are they consistent with the quality schools that drew us to Monona. For these reasons we oppose splitting our great Monona Grove School District!
69 comments:
Peter-
I so appreciate your blog. Your willingness to communicate with the people of the community is, if no other, the reason you should be re elected. This listing of the agenda and the explaination of your take on things makes it all very clear and understandable. And your willingness to dig up old research and data to consistently back up your points is so admirable.
I know that there are folks who use this blog for a lot of information about the schools and then won't vote for you. That is sad.
Thank you Thank you Thank you.
Yes, the world is falling apart because the school board is considering closing Maywood school. No one will want to come to our school district.
Yet open enrollment applicants wanting to attend MG outnumber those wanting to leave MG by a 5-to-1 margin. A third of those want to attend our high school. Parents of young children who decry the possible closing of Maywood should spend some time at our wonderful high school to see why all those open enrollment applicants want to go there.
Will the meeting be byob?
Re. the 21 open enrollment requests for 4K - it's my understanding that you can't request to enroll in 4k if your current school district doesn't offer 4K.
Do you have any idea where these requests are coming from as they can't be from Madison which doesn't offer 4K?
And if the Maywood/Winnequah consolidation does go ahead will one classroom for morning and afternoon 4K classes be sufficient?
my concern at this point is that if you decide to combine Maywood and Winnequah that there is not enough time to do any renovations. I worry that what will be done "will be just good enough" and haphazard and no where the $200-300k that will be needed to do it right. The kids will be stuck going to the school that is "just good enough". Then after one year there, the board will say "you lasted just fine in a school just good enough" and never do the renovations to complete the job. Basically screwing the people of Monona out of a decent renovation. (in addition to closing a beloved school)
"my concern at this point is that if you decide to combine Maywood and Winnequah that there is not enough time to do any renovations. I worry that what will be done "will be just good enough..."
Please listen to the one person in this district most qualified to answer this question, and it's Ann Schroeder. She said (at a public meeting, available on tape) the building is well-suited to hold pre-K-through-2nd grade, has restrooms and sinks and other amenities suitable for young children, and other than some additions like storage cabinets, doesn't need a complete overhaul to accomodate young students.
Not enough time? This decision, if made tomorrow, will provide five months to do the few things needed at Winnequah to get it ready for our youngest students.
Since when did Winnequah get screwed out of a renovation? Have you even been in the building in the past year? The renovations there have greatly improved it, including providing for a very secure entrance.
if it is move in ready, then why does it need $200-300k of renovations (I believe Ann stated that it needs these renovations to be ready for a combined building)?? Sorry, your argument against the previous poster does not add up for me.
The estimated renovation cost is $100,000 to $300,000 (see the board documents posted on the website), and Ann clearly indicated at a board meeting that, in her view, the renovations of Winnequah to accomodate pre-K-2nd grade would not have to be extensive, i.e., very little in the way of extensive and costly plumbing, no major classrooms overhauls -- mainly storage for elementary school items, some desks and chairs, and a few other classrooms items specifically for young children.
The estimate of $100,000-$300,000 is an educated guess, and the renovations are likely to be on the lesser end of that. Some classrooms currently used by Winnequah teachers will have to be moved, but that's not a major renovation expense, simply a moving one.
what will be the probable change to class sizes?
If you vote to shudder Maywood, may I kindly suggest that you all sing the school song before you vote.
Perhaps if you had spent less time on your elementary school song and more time on spelling you would know that the word is "shutter".
I think this a perfect example of the problem - people in this district care about school songs but NOT about what our children learn.
Dear anal,
"Perhaps if you had spent less time on your elementary school song and more time on spelling you would know that the word is "shutter".
"I think this a perfect example of the problem - people in this district care about school songs but NOT about what our children learn."
I meant shudder: "to tremble with a sudden convulsive movement, as from horror, fear, or cold. "
My word choice was on purpose.
It makes sense to move 6th graders out to Glacial Drumlin.
6th grade has been a historical "start" of middle school, and keeping Monona's kids in a elementary setting is putting them at a disadvantage both in education and in socialization with Cottage Grove kids. Most 6th graders are mature enough to handle the bus ride.
Glacial Drumlin was built with the support of Monona voters, because they wanted an improved facility for Monona's children too. Winnequah is much better then it was, but now lacks the staff who is out at GD.
With the other likely cuts, there will probably be staff that needs to teach more classes, and moving 6th graders lets you save time and money to do this (vs. driving between 2 buildings).
I am trying to find the exact results online but having difficulty. I would love it if someone could find the exact total broken down by towns. The referendum passed with 59% approval...not "overwhelming" if you ask me. But what I am remembering is that the people of Monona did not support overwhelming...more like 10-15% voted for it and 85-90% voted against it. Cottage Grove had the opposite ratio (so 90% for it and 10% against). More people from CG showed up at the polls that day. I would love to find the actual results.
The "people of Monona" voted for this referendum keeps been thrown out there. What I am recalling is Monona did not but the district as a whole did.
It really does make sense sooner than later. In ways, I am sad to see that Winnequah housing all district 4th and 5th graders and GD housing 6-8th graders taken off the table in last years ad hoc committee. It would have been so wonderful to have the kids start together younger than older. It would solve all overcrowding issues in CG, fill up Winnequah, help with the kids getting to know each other sooner than later, and Maywood would stay open. There are a lot of wins with that plan.
It is unfortunate it is no longer an option.
I remember it was said that 59% Yes was nearly a Wisconsin record for school referendums. In most elections anything over 52% or so is considered a huge victory. So yes, it was overwhelming.
The Monona yes vote was 30%.
I do not think residents of Monona or Cottage Grove would believe busing 4th and 5th graders to the other community is a "win." Also, this would not solve the alleged crowding at GD that people are worried about if Monona 6th graders go out there.
More people from Cottage Grove did not show up at the polls, even when you combine the village and the town. Cottage Grove has never had a larger voter turnout than Monona.
The referendum passed by well over 1,000 votes, not exactly a close margin in an election with about 6,200 people voting (3,637 -- yes; 2,535 -- no). Monona voted 35 percent yes, 65 percent no. Cottage Grove (village and town) voted 85 percent yes, 15 percent no. Overall, it passed with 59 percent approving.
You'd be hard-pressed to find a district in the last decade the size of MG (@ 3,000 students) passing that big of a referendum ($28.7 million) by that big of a margin (59-41 percent) in the entire state. There may be a few, but not many.
Election results:
http://www.countyofdane.com/clerk/elect2006b.html
Referenda results:
http://www2.dpi.state.wi.us/sfsref/ref_Home.aspx
"Cottage Grove has never had a larger voter turnout than Monona."
This is incorrect. In the 2008 presidential election, Cottage Grove (town and village combined)registered 5,716 votes for the presidential race. Monona registered 5,126 votes. Even if you discount the town of Cottage Grove vote by 10 percent (roughly 90 percent of the town's population lives in the portion of the town that is within the MG school district boundaries; a small portion of the town lies outside the district boundaries), the combined town and village CG vote in the fall of 2008 was around 5,500 votes, or nearly 400 more than Monona.
thank you. over time memories fade.
The referendum was flawed because most referendums are flawed as they result from a political process and in this case too many people in this district wanted their way or the highway. Once the High school referendum was passed, a decade of fighting over the middle school ensued. MG POP tried to put together a compromise. Compromises are always flawed.
I like that the whole thing was "about the children." When it had nothing to do with the children.
Big expensive referenda are almost always "flawed" in some way, if by that you mean "not perfect." The referendum that passed was like much of public policy these days -- some good, some not-so, but in the long run a step forward. (Something that folks who have never served on publicly elected bodies -- and thus can always criticize the compromises inevitable when making public decisions -- never quite grasp. You really do have to sit on a publicly elected body to fully grasp the nature of hard choices among less-than-ideal outcomes.)
The middle school referendum was in the long run in the best interests of the MG district. Was it perfect? No -- many folks had to swallow hard to support it, whether it was bussing Monona kids to CG, or splitting 6th graders, or simply the expense of the thing. But school boards exist in part to improve things, and the current board deserves some praise and respect for moving in this direction (bringing 6th graders together again in one building).
supported and the referendum because I believed, and still do, that it was in the best interest of the district. We clearly had a problem with middle school facilities that didn't support our programming, and the referendum solved that problem.
"supported and the referendum because I believed, and still do, that it was in the best interest of the district. We clearly had a problem with middle school facilities that didn't support our programming, and the referendum solved that problem."
Well great, I was happy to see that you corrected the flaw in the referendum-I feel better. I do have some other suggestions-
Do not upgrade the bathroom at Maywood. It is a waste of money because it will only have to be closed in a few years if not sooner.
I could keep going but you get the point.
re:Winnequah district 4-5.
I imagine it is too late now, but would it be possible to save money and use our space in this configuration by shifting the start of the school day for GDS? So kids get bussed in to Winnequah/High School for an 8:00 start, and that bus then circles Monona and returns to Cottage Grove to pickup and take kids to GDS for a 9:00 start.
Does this add more (by repeating routes and driver hours) or save (by using both directions to pick up kids)? Is this similar to what is done now? Again, it's probably too late for this year, but I didn't know if it had been looked at. Thank you.
At least we don't live in Kansas City:
http://host.madison.com/news/article_93c230e5-b5ca-5012-847a-57e712646e52.html
That is a really sad news story. It shows this is not just an MG problem, but we are a nation with our priorities screwed up. I know I'll get hammered for saying this, but I have lived in this district for a long time and I have seen family after family have all kinds of money for stuff like spring break trips to Disney, teens who have very nice cars, houses with multiple big screen tvs, kids wearing clothes from the expensive mall stores, and well, you get the picture. I do not mean all families as there are many who struggle. But there are plenty of well off people in this community and throughout this nation. Why are we so reluctant to pay a few more dollars in taxes to fund stuff like exemplary public education and really good health care for all? There are plenty of people with plenty of money who could afford the tax increase.
Those are really good comments about the bus and schedules. I know John looks at these issues very hard each year, and I will ask him about it. We really need to think outside the box with the budget problems-
The big cost of grades 4-5 districtwide in Monona at Winnequah, is this:
There is a very substantial cost in creating an all-new system of bussing in CG that involves picking up 300+ 4th and 5th graders all over the town and village and taking them to Monona. Because of the time involved in doing so, and the number of kids, it really involves multiple busses -- at least a half-dozen?
One of the justifications for doing this would be to ease enrollment pressures at CG school (not TP -- the CG school). But you'd still be bussing kids to both TP (grades pre-K-1st) and CG school (grades 2 and 3), and then add on top of that a whole different set of bus routes for 4th/5th graders from CG to Monona.
It's a much bigger problem, in terms of costs, to bus from CG to Monona, than the other way around. The current Monona-to-CG bussing for 7th/8th graders involves all of two busses, because of the (relatively) modest numbers of Monona children enrolled at GDS.
i don't like the idea of bussing 4th and 5th graders from CG to Monona. I don't think parents want their children at that age to be riding the bus that long.
Personally, I wouldn't want my 6th grader being bussed either - but that's now happening. It's a shame, I prefer kids to stay in their community as long as possible.
Matt:
And I prefer my kid get out and meet some new kids by the 6th grade. I think reasonable people can disagree about this, but putting my kid on a bus in return for access to all that GDS has to offer, and a broader range of classmates, is well worth it.
Peter as you were a big popper feel free to disagree with me. Keeping 6th grade in Monona was the ref nod to Monona that education students in our fine city important to the residents?
While I think that the previous super was not the best he was not an idiot. Thus, he knew that educational it was not the best educational experience (whatever that mean.) However supporters like you convinced the board and super that this was imporant.
So-your refusal to vote against the 6th grade is a reversal of your opinion that local schools are important to our seperate communities, right?
Or do you just flip flop for fun?
PS I am not sure what is more agitating you flip flopping or no voters flip flopping.
It is funny how we think that when an elected official changes his/her mind about something, it is "flip flopping" if we disagree with that change, but if we agree with the change, then that person is being thoughtful, evolutionary in their thinking, capable of adapting to new information, etc.
Referendums are always very imperfect. A lot of people who supported that referendum were not wild about the 6th grade situation. I sincerely doubt there were tons of people who voted yes because the 6th graders were staying in Monona and would have voted no if they had been included. Most of the current outspoken people against this move were against the referendum anyway.
It is stunning how many people are simply ignoring what the teachers and administrators are saying about this. They are in these schools every single day. The board did what they should do which is listen to the professionals. Even Ms. Manning said she thought this was best for the kids but refused to support it because, well, I didn't really understand what she said.
"it is "flip flopping" if we disagree with that change, but if we agree with the change, then that person is being thoughtful, evolutionary in their thinking, capable of adapting to new information, etc. "
I think the point is that the previous board at least recognize that the citizens of Monona wanted their kids educated in their city. The previous board at least tried to accommodate that request to the extent the could.
This rogue board has found a away to ignore that request and toss it away.
At least, Sue Manning was able to find a way to vote no.
"it is "flip flopping" if we disagree with that change, but if we agree with the change, then that person is being thoughtful, evolutionary in their thinking, capable of adapting to new information, etc. "
I think the point is that the previous board at least recognize that the citizens of Monona wanted their kids educated in their city. The previous board at least tried to accommodate that request to the extent the could.
This rogue board has found a away to ignore that request and toss it away.
At least, Sue Manning was able to find a way to vote no.
As an engaged Monona voter who supported Jessica Ace and Susan Fox, and even spent money on their campaigns, I am disgusted at what has occurred with this most recent vote.
Makes me think I won't be spending money on political candidates any time soon.
What do you have to offer, if not your word?
"Rogue board?"
This strikes me as a pretty representative group of people, all duly elected by voters of this district -- one who taught in the district, some who've lived here awhile, some relative newcomers, some with kids in the schools, some not. All put in the hard work to get elected, and all of them at least deserve a measure of respect for the time and effort they've put into this budget debate, regardless of whether or not you agree with a particular decision.
Looking at the past referendum results, I think the current board would be hard-pressed to divine any particular intent on the part of "Monona" voters. Two-thirds of them voted against the thing; presumably those folks still don't like the idea of ever placing their kid on a bus to CG (evident at various public hearings), or have come to accept it as part of the deal in living in this odd, dis-jointed district.
And is one more grade really that big of a deal? I don't buy the slippery-slope conspiracy theories being tossed around (like the board will start bussing kindergartners in Monona to CG). This current board, and previous boards, have shown a deep reluctance to bus young children out of their home communities for elementary education. And the high school's not moving, either.
Are 6th graders really not ready, or old enough, to leave the womb of Monona for a middle school education that the educators of this district say will be in their best interests? Do people really think Ann Schroeder, Renee Tenant, Craig Gerlach and Bill Breisch -- all with considerable experience as principals -- don't know what they are talking about? Does combining 6th grade frighten children, or parents?
I find it odd that the one board member who most often talks (and talks and talks...) about serving the needs of children voted against a measure that the educators she pays to run this district say will be in the best interests of children. Then again, maybe it's not odd, but par for the course. Good to see the six board members -- listen to Jessica Ace for those still on the fence on this -- do right by kids.
"Two-thirds of them voted against the thing; presumably those folks still don't like the idea of ever placing their kid on a bus to CG (evident at various public hearings), or have come to accept it as part of the deal in living in this odd, dis-jointed district."
Then why aren't we busing 5th graders to Winnequah to give them an el. ed experiences? It would be better to bring them together sooner, right?
"This current board, and previous boards, have shown a deep reluctance to bus young children out of their home communities for elementary education."
Past boards have shown that-I can't argue that point. However, I did not hear deep reluctance, did you? Honestly? I will look at the tape for the long discussion about busing and those issues-it must be there.
"Do people really think Ann Schroeder, Renee Tenant, Craig Gerlach and Bill Breisch -- all with considerable experience as principals -- don't know what they are talking about? "
OK, all those folks said that this plan would work, right, and now it does not? Further, they did not have their story straight. Ann said they were not getting the same experience, Renee says they are getting a middle school experience because we are bending over backwards and it is difficult, Craig says it will save money, but he has not done the calculations about how much and starts to get a little gruff about the whole issue when he gets asked how much. Do I need to go on with this thread? Their story lines does not instill confidence.
"I find it odd that the one board member who most often talks (and talks and talks...) about serving the needs of children voted against a measure that the educators she pays to run this district say will be in the best interests of children."
I have no problem with a school board member questioning these aspects. Have I told you about the time my 5th grader had to look up definitions of words for homework? The problem with the assignment was every other word had no definition because it was not a word. The justification of this method by the teacher was, it will get them to slow down and take more time with homework.
Again, the storyline being fed to us does not instill confidence-at times and the storyline being fed to me-just brought more questions and worries.
"As an engaged Monona voter who supported Jessica Ace and Susan Fox, and even spent money on their campaigns, I am disgusted at what has occurred with this most recent vote.
Makes me think I won't be spending money on political candidates any time soon.
"
I agree with you-there is no point.
re: "OK, all those folks said that this plan would work, right, and now it does not?"
To be nitpicky, no. Gerlach was not here and this is basicly the first time he's spoke on the issue.
Tenant was principal at Cottage Grove Elementary at the time, and while I don't remember, she probably wasn't asked about students she wouldn't supervise.
I don't remember if Schroeder or Breisch spoke on the issue.
Either way, what all are saying now is it could work better, and possibly save money. I'm glad the administration is looking for improvements, and while change is hard, the arguements are very strong that it is a smart thing to do.
Kudos to the board to stepping up and making a tough decision...at least 6 of you did. Begging off and claiming ignorance is such a cop out. This issue has been talked about so many times. Of course, you would have to actually pay attention to know that. The Ad Hoc Committee talked about this for weeks...and weeks. It has been in the paper many times. READ people!!! We all have had the same opportunities to educate ourselves. Sue Fox should get a nod for all she has done to go the extra mile to communicate. To the Board - thanks for sticking up for the kids. Our middle schoolers belong together!!
Ditto on kudos to the six board members. I particularly admire Ms. Fox, Ms. Ace and Mr. Sobol for this decision as the Monona crowd they disappointed can be quite nasty on a very personal level.
Just because you support someone for election does not mean they are beholden to you on each and every decision. Supporting someone means that you trust them to look at every factor and make the best decisions for the district as a whole and particularly for the students. Maybe instead of being upset, people should ponder why it is that all but one Monona member had the guts to do what they did. Surely they could have taken the easier path of agreeing with the people who helped them get elected. I suspect they did this because they know it is the right thing to do. They will have my vote in the future.
"Ditto on kudos to the six board members. I particularly admire Ms. Fox, Ms. Ace and Mr. Sobol for this decision as the Monona crowd they disappointed can be quite nasty on a very personal level. "
Nasty on a personal level-I don't think anyone, not one person got nasty. Perhaps, there was one, but no one took him serious anyway and heck he had a point.
I think people always feel a little "tricked" when candidates who win vote different than they said they would, agree?
Peter – you refer to a “contract” from the last referendum. I believe you were part of the Preserve Our Partnership (POP) group during that last referendum and looking at the January 10, 2006press release from the school district, part of the promise made to secure votes from Monona residents was keeping 6th graders at Winnequah and young children at Maywood. Specifically, the press release states:
“The POP proposal, and the board’s referendum, provides millions of dollars to rehab and renovate Winnequah for Monona elementary children in grades 3-6. Maywood school received a new roof and other upgrades several years ago and is in good physical shape, and thus minimal work is needed to keep that building operating for Monona’s youngest children. In Cottage Grove, the move of the 5th graders to the new building alleviates crowding in the elementary facilities.”
Am I correct to assume this is the “contract” to which you refer? If so, do you plan to break the remainder of that “contract” and close Maywood?
I never heard or saw any of the board members say they would never agree to have Monona 6th graders go to Glacial Drumlin. Fox took a leadership role in opposing the GD referendum and one thing she did not like about it was that it did not include the 6th grade. Of course I do not believe for one minute she would have supported it even if it had included Monona 6th graders, but nobody should be surprised she believes the 6th grade should be together in this district.
As for the nasty/mean quotient among a small number of people, I think the fact that most of us choose to remain anonymous attests to that. If we felt we would be respected instead of belittled or ascribed nefarious motives for our ideas, we would sign our names.
I live in Monona and voted yes on the referendum despite the fact it did not include Monona 6th grades. Many of my friends did too. I believe the board corrected a problem and am glad they did.
"Then why aren't we busing 5th graders to Winnequah to give them an el. ed experiences? It would be better to bring them together sooner, right?"
No, it wouldn't. I think reasonable people can always disagree about the best time to bring together the children of these two communities into one school. I mean, we could start in kindergarten. (But no one would seriously suggest that, for some pretty obvious financial reasons.) For that matter, we could wait until 12th grade.
The key question is -- when does it make sense educationally (and socially) to bring kids together? 6th grade makes a lot of sense, because it represents a significant demarcation in how we educate children (and have, historically) in this district. We move from an elementary curriculum, and schedule, to a middle-school curriculum and schedule. We provide more choices for children, on the assumption they are mature enough and ready for those additional choices. It's the single most significant transition for children to make, save perhaps for the one from 8th grade to 9th grade. It seems like a logical point to bring kids together.
To some extent, the wonderful opportunities that our district provides at the high school level have their foundation in our middle school programming. And that begins in the 6th grade.
In the end, everyone in the district probably wants their children educated closest to home. But for many, many parents (and in the best educational interests of children), that desire gets trumped by the advantages of having one, cohesive school offering all of the children (6th graders) a rich and diverse curriculum.
Wow- A lot of people on here are so smart and wise about this thing. The board stepped up and did a great thing- corrected something that needed correcting- and previous posters are right- there is a small group, very small, of Monona folks who are upset about it, and who get very nasty and personal, so we all stay anonymous, and stay home from the meetings. But most folks, even Manning although she made absolutely no sense at the meeting, understand that this is the best educational decision for our kids, and thus voted so--- which is their job-- Bravo!
"As for the nasty/mean quotient among a small number of people,"
SO the POP group were not nasty and mean to people and are still not, they eat lollipops and poop rainbows?
To be clear, Ms. Manning voted against having Monona 6th grade attend Glacial Drumlin.
"SO the POP group were not nasty and mean to people and are still not, they eat lollipops and poop rainbows?"
Wow. 'nuff said.
re: "POP Contract."
OK this is a little too much for me. The POP quote in the post above looks more like a press release or campaign flyer then a contract, and references "the board’s referendum," which seems to be the "contract" in question. A press release is not a contract by any measure, and Sobol's membership in the group doesn't mean he wrote this either.
Furthermore the POP quote doesn't say "we will keep Maywood open," it says (to paraphrase) "Maywood.. is in good physical shape, and thus minimal work is needed to keep that building operating." Keeping Maywood open can be read into it, but it isn't stated directly. The whole paragraph seems to be talking about the structural status of Monona's schools, which still seems to be accurate (Winequah was remodled and Maywood is in good shape). The building isn't being considered for closure because it needs to be repaired.
To me, this reaction seems to be a "I told you so" attitude by people opposed to the referendum. But our problem now is fiscal, and our problem then was structural (overcrowded buildings in need of repair). Think of it this way, where would we be now without the referendum? We would have 2 major problems to solve instead of 1. Winnequah would be run down and overcrowded, and we would still have to cut a million bucks from the budget or more (we would be paying more in busing costs). Who is going to move to our district in that situation?
I'm a Monona resident and have felt that Maywood should close for the past few years, and am not convinced my arguments have persuaded Mr. Sobol or any other board members. I get more confident when I see posts such as the one I'm referring to. The opposition is hurting their case when they play 'gotcha' with a 4 year old flyer that seems to still be accurate.
"Past boards have shown that-I can't argue that point. However, I did not hear deep reluctance, did you? Honestly? I will look at the tape for the long discussion about busing and those issues-it must be there."
Board president Fox, at an earlier meeting discussing various grade configurations in the district, cited as one reason not to make Winnequah a district-wide 4th/5th grade building the "total lack of support" (trying to quote accurately here -- it's essentially what she said if you watch the meeting) among parents of CG 4th and 5th graders to having their children bussed into Monona.
That contrasts to publicly expressed support from Monona parents in the past few years for: building the middle school in CG; combining 6th graders at GDS; and closing Maywood. True, all of those generated vocal and sometimes strident opposition in Monona. But that opposition wasn't universal; as much as the very vocal and persistent Monona critics of this and previous boards might wish it weren't so, there are lots of parents in Monona who support these things.
"I think the point is that the previous board at least recognize that the citizens of Monona wanted their kids educated in their city."
I have to say that I received input on both sides of this issue, I don't have a scorecard but I have to say it was roughly equal. One side was more vocal, but you can't make a blanket statement about what the citizens of Monona wanted with the 6th grade issue. As always, please speak for yourself here not a presumed group.
"Board member Susan Manning was the lone vote against the proposal, even though she agreed that staff and administration have made a compelling case, and that it was probably “the right thing to do for the kids.”
That being the case, she said she wanted to base her decision on solid information, and that she was not sure she had all the information she required to do so. She was particularly concerned with future open enrollment decisions and how that would affect overall enrollment and possible crowding of common areas at Glacial Drumlin."
That means 6 in support and one supportive but without enough information. Essentially this was a unanimous decision.
Yes, it was basically unanimous. And it was a good, decisive vote. Move on people.
I am happily surprised that the board members from Monona, where I live, did not give into the pressure of the group, and listened to the administrators, teachers, and the majority of the parents out here. Tough vote, I know, but kudos!
"am happily surprised that the board members from Monona, where I live, did not give into the pressure of the group, and listened to the administrators, teachers, and the majority of the parents out here"
The majority of the parents?
The majority of parents want their 6th graders educated in the grove?
I think Manning just should have said the referendum passed made a commitment to our local schools, I vote no.
"majority of the parents out here"
"
Peter, I make a citizen's arrest this person violoted your heresay law.
I bought my home in Monona before kids 9 years ago. I admit I did it with the warm fuzzy feeling that my kids would be able to WALK to school k-12. We both grew up in a rural area and it would give my kids what I didn't have...no long bus rides. The referendum passed and I took it hard because my warm fuzzy dream that I had for my kids would not come to fruition. Since then, I really have not much of a reason to go to that part of the district (Cottage Grove). In the last year due to board things and other events, we have drove to GD. Really, it was not at the end of the earth...but a short 15 minute ride. What a beautiful facility. My middle school was a mess when I went to it. My kids won't have plaster falling off the ceilings and the windows shut unlike my school (and this was a Wisconsin school!). Also, I must admit, I swelled with pride when I saw the great facilities being spotlighted on the news and in the paper in the last week. Kudos to the people who made that grant possible for wellness equipment.
If Maywood closes, I will mourn. It really is a great collection of people who have educated my child in a way I couldn't have asked for more. I have fear of the unknown of how the new combined school will work. I hope that the new will work as well. There are a lot of positives of combining the schools too. I think time will tell.
I have hated how this divided our towns again. It hurt at the meeting when the guy presented the petition of the CG teachers to close our school. I felt like we were on a healing path to have this budget issue set us back to the bitterness that was around when the referendum was passed. It has made for some very hard feelings between people that were on good terms before. I wish we could all get along (I know, idealistic...) The kids will..lets let them lead us by example and let us get along too. Most reasonable parents wouldn't let our kids behave the way some adults have been behaving. The board did what they had to for financial reasons. I imagine the potential Maywood closing for the same reason. If I was wealthy...I would love to bail out the school but our modest means doesn't allow it. I give our board credit to doing what they felt was right...whether it was Susan Manning, Jill List or Jessica Ace (etc). I feel better about this group than I did about the one 5 years ago. I haven't seen them heckle anyone and are open to listening to the people.(which I can't say was the case before)
Thanks for an honest and frank account of your thoughts. I'd only quibble with the line about the petition of "CG teachers to close our school."
Many teachers, regardless of where they teach, live in the district -- and quite a few who teach in CG schools live in Monona (and send their children, or did, in Monona). Several Monona-school-based teachers live in CG. I believe the teacher petition was not based on wanting to close a building in one community, but to preserve programs that serve (or eventually do) all children in the district.
"If Maywood closes, I will mourn. It really is a great collection of people who have educated my child in a way I couldn't have asked for more. "
Exactly! Maywood is a great collection of people, but those same people will be educating your children just a block away, and to short change those great people in order to hang on to a building just isn't fair to them!
You people on here crack me up.
Dont' short change these teachers for a building??
"These teachers" are gone next year. No way I would vote yes on a referendum for more money.
The MGSB should send 3-5 graders back to Nichols for a couple years. During that time, tear down Winnequah and build a new, modern school for Monona's pre-K through 5th grades with geo-thermal heating, a modern gymnasium with a climbing wall and pods to separate the ages. After the new school opens, donate Maywood to the city and sell Nichols and the administration building to the highest bidder. Then send the rascals out the CG where they belong!
"The MGSB should send 3-5 graders back to Nichols for a couple years. During that time, tear down Winnequah and build a new, modern school for Monona's pre-K through 5th grades with geo-thermal heating, a modern gymnasium with a climbing wall and pods to separate the ages. After the new school opens, donate Maywood to the city and sell Nichols and the administration building to the highest bidder."
I like this idea and Peter is on the record of saying that new buildings decrease operating expenses.
"Peter, I make a citizen's arrest this person violoted your heresay law."
Yes, the commentor should have said "what is in my opinion the majority of Monona parents".
I've heard that today's homes are about 25% more effecient then homes from the 1970s (more insulation, vapor barriers, better windows, etc.) and presumably the same goes for new schools.
The geo-thermal heating sytem is a great idea. Once installed, the heat is basically free from the earth (there's a little electricty used to power the pumps). GDS is built into a hill and faces south to get some extra solar heat too.
Putting a school closer to the students saves on bussing, and about 90% of the energy in gas is lost as heat to the atmosphere.
Do to the odd way that governments have to budget, saving on utilty expensise like this save's money, while building referendum expenses are not counted. Having GDS open instead of Nichols is probably cheeper right now, and as gas/energy goes up, the savings will magnify.
Of course the cost to build any new building (which isn't counted in a budget mess like we're in), is hard to pass in every town. Usually schools need to fall apart, or be overcrowded before you get people to vote for it. While replacing Winnequah with a new effecient building would probably save money on the budget side, it was remodled 2 years ago and is at 50% capacity. A referendum to build a new one wouldn't pass.
A new school in Monona would be great, but I think it would be a difficult thing to swallow for the district taxpayers to fund a second school at this time.
Winnequah (and possibly Maywood are still viable school buildings. Are they as nice as GD? No way. But they can still work.
I seriously doubt you could get a referendum passed building a new school for $10-20 million (or whatever it would cost).
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